What would you do? - Page 3

NorthShore · #61 08-26-2015, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leafy

I realize the Wildlife Act regulates hunting in Alberta in which I gave you the example of hunting at night, section 28 of the Act. Now, where do you find baiting in the Act ? Or is this found in out provincial big game regulations.

Page 67 of the pdf linked. Item 2 #5 of the schedule.

Leafy · #62 08-26-2015, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthShore

Page 67 of the pdf linked. Item 2 #5 of the schedule.

That would be under Part 9 Regulations and Transitional Provisions

LIR · #63 08-26-2015, 02:55 PM

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=240041

When I confronted the guy that started the above thread, last year everybody jumped to his defense.

How about all the people dancing around the legality by feeding deer year-round to develop their dependence, and then removing the feeder on Oct 31st, while waiting to ambush the feed spot on Nov 1st?

Can someone explain to me how these people are ethical hunters? Isn't this an unfair advantage over hunters who do not temper with wildlife ever?

Someone is guessing that as many as 60% of hunters are baiting deer. If that is true, I hope that this 60% of hunters die of horrible wasting disease...

/There is no dilemma. Report these SOB poachers

waterninja · #64 08-26-2015, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthShore

Page 67 of the pdf linked. Item 2 #5 of the schedule.

Thats weird. I am looking at the pdf of the wildlife act from the queens printer and it ends on page 64. There is no page 67.
Can someone post a link with the rules/legislation about baiting deer? Thanks

abhunter8 · #65 08-26-2015, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulehahn

I would tell them to smarten up and hunt legally. But if they continued I would report them. Then again I have reported a really close friend, and but I at least stepped up and told him I did it. I had told him several times to stop and he called my bluff. He was never busted as they have to actually catch you in the act, but it may be enough to make them stop.

I may not agree with every law on the books, but I follow them and work to have them changed if I disagree. I expect others to do the same.

This is exactly how I would handle it.

Okotokian · #66 08-26-2015, 03:44 PM

IMHO, those who use bait are robbing THEMSELVES of the pleasure of hunting. Baiting and waiting for game to show up is simply harvesting, not hunting. It's also boring. LOL But that's just my opinion, not a universal moral conclusion or anything to do with the law. If you want to go to Saskatchewan and shoot over bait, great. I've no issue with that. Heck, I have a tree stand I haven't used for years because I just find it boring.

NorthShore · #67 08-26-2015, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterninja

Thats weird. I am looking at the pdf of the wildlife act from the queens printer and it ends on page 64. There is no page 67.
Can someone post a link with the rules/legislation about baiting deer? Thanks

http://www.qp.alberta.ca/documents/Acts/W10.pdf

page 67 of this pdf. page 63 of the actual document.

Item 2
Items prohibited for hunting big game

#5 Any bait consisting of a food attractant, including a mineral and
any representation of a food attractant.

Along with the parts that state you cant use FMJ for hunting big game or a calibre less the .23.

waterninja · #68 08-26-2015, 04:36 PM

Thanks North. Gee, thats all there is to it? I always thought there was more to it then that.

elkhunter11 · #69 08-26-2015, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Cody Robbins throws down a pile of red spot in Saskatchewan and arrows a 200" whitetail ,people can't praise for being the greatest guy in the world then have him take two steps over the border, do the exact same thing and call him a poaching SOB.

Yes people can, because when you start committing offenses under the Wildlife Act, you instantly become a poacher. Even B&C would refuse to enter that whitetail if it was killed over bait in Alberta.

Kurt505 · #70 08-26-2015, 07:34 PM

What if we changed the wording of the scenario to read "If you knew one of your friends was selling pot, would you turn them in?"?

deerguy · #71 08-26-2015, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Yes people can, because when you start committing offenses under the Wildlife Act, you instantly become a poacher. Even B&C would refuse to enter that whitetail if it was killed over bait in Alberta.

Because it's illegal not because it is wrong. There is a difference.

Okotokian · #72 08-27-2015, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winger7mm

"bait" is basically defined as food attractants or the like. Sexual attractants, urines that kind of stuff since they dont represent food they are allowed.

yup.

Okotokian · #73 08-27-2015, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerguy

Because it's illegal not because it is wrong. There is a difference.

Yes, agreed, though don't the kills also have to be fair chase? That's a moral/ethical definition, not a legal one.

Leafy · #74 08-27-2015, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Yes, agreed, though don't the kills also have to be fair chase? That's a moral/ethical definition, not a legal one.

All registered systems which accept animals for record purposes feel this method is fair chase. Where is the moral or ethical issue ?

deerguy · #75 08-27-2015, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Yes, agreed, though don't the kills also have to be fair chase? That's a moral/ethical definition, not a legal one.

Yes they do.

My gripe is mostly just with people on AO basing their views strictly off of what the law is.

You either agree with the act of putting food out with intent to harvest or you don't. Regardless of the law.

They could make it illegal to sleep with your spouse and guys on here would flat out stop doing it and call for the heads of guys that don't all because it's now ILLEGAL.

Just makes no sense to not think for yourself and come up with your own conclusions on things all while still following the law.

elkhunter11 · #76 08-27-2015, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leafy

All registered systems which accept animals for record purposes feel this method is fair chase. Where is the moral or ethical issue ?

B&C will not accept submissions that were not killed in accordance with the local regulations. They will accept submissions that were killed over bait where it is legal to use bait, but they won't accept submissions killed over bait where baiting is not legal.

http://www.boone-crockett.org/huntin...=huntingEthics

Quote:

FAIR CHASE STATEMENT
FAIR CHASE, as defined by the Boone and Crockett Club, is the ethical, sportsmanlike, and lawful pursuit and taking of any free-ranging wild, native North American big game animal in a manner that does not give the hunter an improper advantage over such animals.

HUNTER ETHICS
Fundamental to all hunting is the concept of conservation of natural resources. Hunting in today's world involves the regulated harvest of individual animals in a manner that conserves, protects, and perpetuates the hunted population. The hunter engages in a one-to-one relationship with the quarry and his or her hunting should be guided by a hierarchy of ethics related to hunting, which includes the following tenets:

1. Obey all applicable laws and regulations.

2. Respect the customs of the locale where the hunting occurs.

3. Exercise a personal code of behavior that reflects favorably on your abilities and sensibilities as a hunter.

4. Attain and maintain the skills necessary to make the kill as certain and quick as possible.

5. Behave in a way that will bring no dishonor to either the hunter, the hunted, or the environment.

6. Recognize that these tenets are intended to enhance the hunter's experience of the relationship between predator and prey, which is one of the most fundamental relationships of humans and their environment.

DCse7en · #77 08-27-2015, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerguy

Well, I am a grown man so seeing as Nothing bad is going on i'd leave it be.

Be more concerned about the losers stealing or tampering with other guys stuff. Or guys taking more then one deer.

1 tag for 1 deer taken in a open season with one bag of food is pretty minor.

It is poaching to bait animals. This should be reported, because it is poaching it would disqualify their registration in the boone and crockett or pope and young record books.

DCse7en · #78 08-27-2015, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerguy

Because it's illegal not because it is wrong. There is a difference.

If it is illegal it is wrong.....ethically, morally, and legally wrong to harvest deer over bait... The law is in place because the people saw fit to make it that way a long time ago, it was not written without consideration...

DCse7en · #79 08-27-2015, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerguy

Yes they do.

My gripe is mostly just with people on AO basing their views strictly off of what the law is.

You either agree with the act of putting food out with intent to harvest or you don't. Regardless of the law.

They could make it illegal to sleep with your spouse and guys on here would flat out stop doing it and call for the heads of guys that don't all because it's now ILLEGAL.

Just makes no sense to not think for yourself and come up with your own conclusions on things all while still following the law.

Nice use of hyperbole. Unfortunately, you are wrong....humans are too horny to stop humpin....

Mike_W · #80 08-27-2015, 01:47 PM

Problem is all these stores selling attractants and electronic calls for big game. Unfortunately not everyone reads the regulations fully and if you were in a Cabelas or WSS you would be led to believe baiting and the use of electronic calls is perfectly legal and everyone does it.

If someone unknowingly sets a bait I would let them know that this is not allowed.
Here is a situation what about a land owner that grants you permission but you notice a bait pile in the back 40 do you confront him, call it in or carry on your way like you never seen it?

deerguy · #81 08-27-2015, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCse7en

If it is illegal it is wrong.....ethically, morally, and legally wrong to harvest deer over bait... The law is in place because the people saw fit to make it that way a long time ago, it was not written without consideration...

So if it is legal It is right?

DCse7en · #82 08-27-2015, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deerguy

So if it is legal It is right?

If you want my opinion fine...I would not bait even if it was legal, but since it is not, my opinion does not matter. Also, I believe I answered that question in the post you quoted...

DCse7en · #83 08-27-2015, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike_W

Problem is all these stores selling attractants and electronic calls for big game. Unfortunately not everyone reads the regulations fully and if you were in a Cabelas or WSS you would be led to believe baiting and the use of electronic calls is perfectly legal and everyone does it.

If someone unknowingly sets a bait I would let them know that this is not allowed.
Here is a situation what about a land owner that grants you permission but you notice a bait pile in the back 40 do you confront him, call it in or carry on your way like you never seen it?

I remember seeing these products in the cabelas catalog with a disclaimer that stated to consult local laws...

Okotokian · #84 08-27-2015, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leafy

All registered systems which accept animals for record purposes feel this method is fair chase. Where is the moral or ethical issue ?

Agreed. I simply meant that B&C does have some criteria based on their ethical interpretation, not merely whether something is legal.

DCse7en · #85 08-27-2015, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Agreed. I simply meant that B&C does have some criteria based on their ethical interpretation, not merely whether something is legal.

This from the policies page on the Boone and Crockett website. They do not condone poaching, which is what hunting certain animals over bait is here...

BAITING
Trophies taken with the aid of bait are eligible for entry in the Club’s Awards Programs and listing in the records books so long as the practice is legal in the state or province where the trophy was taken.

Leafy · #86 08-27-2015, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

B&C will not accept submissions that were not killed in accordance with the local regulations. They will accept submissions that were killed over bait where it is legal to use bait, but they won't accept submissions killed over bait where baiting is not legal.

http://www.boone-crockett.org/huntin...=huntingEthics

I specifically used the word "method" to prevent confusion. I see you missed this point

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCse7en

This from the policies page on the Boone and Crockett website. They do not condone poaching, which is what hunting certain animals over bait is here...

BAITING
Trophies taken with the aid of bait are eligible for entry in the Club’s Awards Programs and listing in the records books so long as the practice is legal in the state or province where the trophy was taken.

Poaching is where an individual with-out a valid wildlife certificate or valid tag / permit for that species harvests said animal.

Having a loaded firearm in a vehicle is illegal, does this make the guilty party a poacher ?

Bushrat · #87 08-27-2015, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leafy

I specifically used the word "method" to prevent confusion. I see you missed this point

Poaching is where an individual with-out a valid wildlife certificate or valid tag / permit for that species harvests said animal.

Having a loaded firearm in a vehicle is illegal, does this make the guilty party a poacher ?

Yes it is poaching when the intent is to use the loaded weapon to shoot an animal from inside the vehicle or to get out without having to spend time loading the gun. All that is illegal, shooting an animal illegally is considered poaching. There are very few people who mistakenly have a loaded gun in their vehicle. 99% of loaded guns in a vehicle are loaded on purpose.

Poaching is taking any animal by any method that is not legal.

Leafy · #88 08-27-2015, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Yes it is poaching when the intent is to use the loaded weapon to shoot an animal from inside the vehicle or to get out without having to spend time loading the gun. All that is illegal, shooting an animal illegally is considered poaching. There are very few people who mistakenly have a loaded gun in their vehicle. 99% of loaded guns in a vehicle are loaded on purpose.

Poaching is taking any animal by any method that is not legal.

Sorry but do disagree. The citation issued for a loaded firearm in a vehicle certainly does not state you are charged with poaching. Petty trespass again does not indicate your poaching does it ?

NorthShore · #89 08-27-2015, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leafy

Sorry but do disagree. The citation issued for a loaded firearm in a vehicle certainly does not state you are charged with poaching. Petty trespass again does not indicate your poaching does it ?

I could be wrong but I dont think you would ever be charged with "poaching". You would be charged with hunting an animal out of season, or hunting without a license, or hunting big game over bait etc...

Leafy · #90 08-27-2015, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthShore

I could be wrong but I dont think you would ever be charged with "poaching". You would be charged with hunting an animal out of season, or hunting without a license, or hunting big game over bait etc...

Yes there have been poaching convictions in Alberta...