Hats off to Minister Loewen

[MountainTi]

Looks to me that wildlife management in Alberta has taken a turn for the better.
Game numbers, aside from predators, have been on the decline for a long time now. Prairie and mountain zones have been hit the hardest but areas such as the one I live in aren't far behind. Years of an overabundance of tags as well as high predator numbers have really taken it's toll on game numbers. In his first year of office he has influenced the reduction of many draw tags as well as supplemental doe tags in areas that needed it. I've heard a lot of whining about a "conflict of interest" but this shows me he is concerned about what has happened to our wildlife. Being a farmer makes one the most qualified for an Ag minister, why not the minister in charge of wildlife as a hunter/part owner in an outfitting business.
In his first year at the helm he has made some much needed changes, hopefully more to come.
Even a much needed grizz hunt in the works ...who woulda thought

[MooseRiverTrapper]

I like the supplemental reduction to none in the 200s, whitetail populations could be considered collapsed in my area, what a shame. Down to one supplemental in the 3-500 WMUs will help.

The massive amount of cow elk tags and they are giving out two tags per licence holder is very concerning. Todd lives up there in elk country, it’s getting harder to find a bull and busier every year. I don’t know if continuing to decimate the elk herd is a good thing??? AB wildlife management sure hates elk.

[BigJon]

Happy to see the whitetail supplemental tag reduced to 1 from 2. Would be even happier to see those tags disappear altogether. 1 general WT tag per person. Use it for a doe in the month of November if you like gives plenty of opportunity for hunters of all ages.

The elk tag situation reminds me of the mule deer slaughter of 2010ish which is disappointing. In the Peace Country a hunter can now kill 3 elk/year if they want to.

The average Alberta hunter just loves to have high body count hunting seasons I guess.

[1dayillgetaram]

He’s the first minister weve had that is actually trying to fix what is wrong. If he can get rid of the bureaucracy involved in wildlife management he should get a medal

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by BigJon

Happy to see the whitetail supplemental tag reduced to 1 from 2. Would be even happier to see those tags disappear altogether. 1 general WT tag per person. Use it for a doe in the month of November if you like gives plenty of opportunity for hunters of all ages.

It was in fact that way back in the 70's and early 80's .
Can't remember when they combined the tag for either antlerless or antlered in our area , but I do know we didn't have near the population of White tails up here then.
Cat

[LKILR]

So less opportunity for residents.

Will he reduce non-resident tags ?

This needs to be fair to residents of Alberta.


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[BigJon]

Originally Posted by LKILR

So less opportunity for residents.

Will he reduce non-resident tags ?

This needs to be fair to residents of Alberta.


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This is a fair point.

I think (some) outfitters still have bonus covid tags as well. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a hard lobby for those to stick around after the covid tags term ends.

I don’t have an outfitter hate on nor do I believe that residents should just keep blasting b/c there’s been no reduction in NR allocations…. Proportional reductions in a WMU’s quota would seem fair though.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by LKILR

So less opportunity for residents.

Will he reduce non-resident tags ?

This needs to be fair to residents of Alberta.


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I think of it as more opportunity for does
Rome wasn't built in a day. Lot of issues to fix

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by MooseRiverTrapper

I like the supplemental reduction to none in the 200s, whitetail populations could be considered collapsed in my area, what a shame. Down to one supplemental in the 3-500 WMUs will help.

The massive amount of cow elk tags and they are giving out two tags per licence holder is very concerning. Todd lives up there in elk country, it’s getting harder to find a bull and busier every year. I don’t know if continuing to decimate the elk herd is a good thing??? AB wildlife management sure hates elk.

It's been so many years since I hunted elk up north I have no clue on what the populations are like up there. Is this on deeded land areas you are referring to? I do know farmers/ranchers have a big dislike for elk due to their destructive nature.
Is there a shortage of cow elk? I know in some prairie zones they have been increasing cow tags for years just to try to get some killed as there are very few taken every year. One area I hunt it would be easier to kill a 300"+ bull than to kill a cow lol.
Again, I know nothing of the northern herds anymore so just curious is all

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by BigJon

Happy to see the whitetail supplemental tag reduced to 1 from 2. Would be even happier to see those tags disappear altogether. 1 general WT tag per person. Use it for a doe in the month of November if you like gives plenty of opportunity for hunters of all ages.

The elk tag situation reminds me of the mule deer slaughter of 2010ish which is disappointing. In the Peace Country a hunter can now kill 3 elk/year if they want to.

The average Alberta hunter just loves to have high body count hunting seasons I guess.

The land mass of Alberta could contain several eastern states, with only a fraction of the population. Sure, more predators and winter kill up here, but all things averaged out I cant understand how a couple deer a year isnt sustainable. Especially considering that we are coming off of a couple easy winters right now, and the higher the deer populations climb the harder they will be hit on the next hard winter.

If tags need to be cut then so be it, but I see alot of guys driving roads and bitching about the deer numbers, while I've let a dozen bucks walk in the last two weeks.

[huntinstuff]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

It was in fact that way back in the 70's and early 80's .
Can't remember when they combined the tag for either antlerless or antlered in our area , but I do know we didn't have near the population of White tails up here then.
Cat

Yup

General tag but only good for does for 4 days in November....and no Sunday hunting unless you were in the northern "green zone"

[MooseRiverTrapper]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

It's been so many years since I hunted elk up north I have no clue on what the populations are like up there. Is this on deeded land areas you are referring to? I do know farmers/ranchers have a big dislike for elk due to their destructive nature.
Is there a shortage of cow elk? I know in some prairie zones they have been increasing cow tags for years just to try to get some killed as there are very few taken every year. One area I hunt it would be easier to kill a 300"+ bull than to kill a cow lol.
Again, I know nothing of the northern herds anymore so just curious is all

This fall up north in one area. I called in 6 bulls over the span of a week and didn’t see or hear one cow. This WMU has 800+ cow tags every year. This year is it 800 x 2?

[FlyTheory]

As long as outfitters also are held to the same standard, I’m all for reductions. But if outfitters can go hog wild, I would not be stoked on that.

[BigJon]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

The land mass of Alberta could contain several eastern states, with only a fraction of the population. Sure, more predators and winter kill up here, but all things averaged out I cant understand how a couple deer a year isnt sustainable. Especially considering that we are coming off of a couple easy winters right now, and the higher the deer populations climb the harder they will be hit on the next hard winter.

If tags need to be cut then so be it, but I see alot of guys driving roads and bitching about the deer numbers, while I've let a dozen bucks walk in the last two weeks.

What you’re implying is noted…. I know what I used to see and I know what I see now in the whitetail woods.

I’m not opposed to antlerless tags when populations are bursting at the seams. I just don’t think that’s the case with whitetails in the Peace Country.

If it would be a bad thing for you to have each hunting family member bring home only one deer a year, then so be it. You do you.

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by FlyTheory

As long as outfitters also are held to the same standard, I’m all for reductions. But if outfitters can go hog wild, I would not be stoked on that.

Just out of curiousity, what kind of numbers do you all want to see? Specifically with the Whitetail?

At least up north, alot of what I see is people assuming the extremely high numbers that we saw around 2005-08'ish were normal. IMO those werent normal numbers, they were the result of a bunch of abnormally mild winters... anyone remember the Valleyview deer cull, I wanna say around 2006? And that happened before the real crash hit.

The first bad winter hit and in over 15 years those areas never recovered to the same level. Even those that are only lightly hunted. But they have come back to a sustainable level, and with hard winters hitting regularly they stay steady. Nope, you cant drive roads or sit in a random cutblock and expect to shoot a 150" deer anymore, but once again, IMO that was neither normal nor sustainable. The idea that we can just stockpile doe's and re-create that is erronious.

[Mountain Guy]

Hopefully they also take into consideration the hunter numbers. They need to take a hard look at it. Exploding population growth, increased interest in hunting for the ''healthy, cheap'' meat, and the exponential growth of those who can kill anything they want, will put a lot of pressure on the game numbers.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by FlyTheory

As long as outfitters also are held to the same standard, I’m all for reductions. But if outfitters can go hog wild, I would not be stoked on that.

A high percentage of the tags reduced are female (deer, moose, western elk) tags. There are no outfitter female tags

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by huntinstuff

Yup

General tag but only good for does for 4 days in November....and no Sunday hunting unless you were in the northern "green zone"

I remember it being the last week of the season you could shoot a doe on your general tag. I could be wrong on that though.
I remember when general mule deer was made a 3 point rule shortly before it went to full draw in the prairies. Sure helped the age structure.

[Hunter Trav]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

It's been so many years since I hunted elk up north I have no clue on what the populations are like up there. Is this on deeded land areas you are referring to? I do know farmers/ranchers have a big dislike for elk due to their destructive nature.
Is there a shortage of cow elk? I know in some prairie zones they have been increasing cow tags for years just to try to get some killed as there are very few taken every year. One area I hunt it would be easier to kill a 300"+ bull than to kill a cow lol.
Again, I know nothing of the northern herds anymore so just curious is all

There's an abundance of elk up north. My grandfather was one of the guys who helped F&W transplant elk from Jasper to the area west of Spirit River. They've done VERY well! And I've also watched the herds in 522 grow for the last 30 some odd years. Never used to be a ton of them there, just in certain pockets. Now they can be a problem for certain guys and they now occupy areas you would never see them in before. I feel like they gave out 2 tags in hopes that the guys who actually do get them every year will be able to take out more since alot of guys go home empty handed. Definitely hoping I can get both of mine filled this year thats for sure!!

[MooseRiverTrapper]

Originally Posted by Hunter Trav

There's an abundance of elk up north. My grandfather was one of the guys who helped F&W transplant elk from Jasper to the area west of Spirit River. They've done VERY well! And I've also watched the herds in 522 grow for the last 30 some odd years. Never used to be a ton of them there, just in certain pockets. Now they can be a problem for certain guys and they now occupy areas you would never see them in before. I feel like they gave out 2 tags in hopes that the guys who actually do get them every year will be able to take out more since alot of guys go home empty handed. Definitely hoping I can get both of mine filled this year thats for sure!!

That’s what they said with peace country mule deer and WT around my place. Let’s all smash two does/cows because there is lots!! Then add in some harsh winters and there is very few.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

The land mass of Alberta could contain several eastern states, with only a fraction of the population. Sure, more predators and winter kill up here, but all things averaged out I cant understand how a couple deer a year isnt sustainable. Especially considering that we are coming off of a couple easy winters right now, and the higher the deer populations climb the harder they will be hit on the next hard winter.

Thing about the eastern and southern states is they have easy winters, few predators, mostly private land that many manage for deer, food plots. In fact you could say in many cases they are basically farming free range deer to say nothing of the actual deer farms. Even their undisturbed natural habitat it is much richer and can support far more deer per square mile than here.
If those states had 5 months of winter when no green fresh nutricious food at all grows, 30 and 40 below sometimes for weeks, black bears, grizzlies, wolves and cougars, to say nothing of year round hunting by certain people.
In other words if their deer herds had to live in the same conditions ours do their deer herds wouldn't be in any better shape than ours, their hunting seasons and bad limits would be similar.

[walking buffalo]

This minister has been absolutely great for the outfitters.

[LKILR]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

This minister has been absolutely great for the outfitters.

Nail on the head


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[MooseRiverTrapper]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

This minister has been absolutely great for the outfitters.

While in his position what great benefits has he provided outfitters?

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Thing about the eastern and southern states is they have easy winters, few predators, mostly private land that many manage for deer, food plots. In fact you could say in many cases they are basically farming free range deer to say nothing of the actual deer farms. Even their undisturbed natural habitat it is much richer and can support far more deer per square mile than here.
If those states had 5 months of winter when no green fresh nutricious food at all grows, 30 and 40 below sometimes for weeks, black bears, grizzlies, wolves and cougars, to say nothing of year round hunting by certain people.
In other words if their deer herds had to live in the same conditions ours do their deer herds wouldn't be in any better shape than ours, their hunting seasons and bad limits would be similar.

Sure, and since we agree that the major variables are feed and winter, how much difference do you think reduced bag limits will make? Once again, WT specific.

My family has only ever taken what we need, which is significantly less than we can get tags for. I remember just once killing a buck that was not a trophy, and was somewhat surplus to my needs. I felt bad about that one, but that winter was harsh and the winterkill was bad... in the end I doubt it mattered one bit whether I killed an extra deer or not.

IMO suplimental tag numbers should be decided by taking into account the amount of snowfall during the past 3 or so seasons. Also wouldnt be bad to factor the amount of usable roads in a WMU into that equasion. I personally was not sorry to see the 2nd tag cut but I felt that doing it this particular season, at least in my area, made very little sense.

[binocular]

There are 32 zones where outfitters have more antlered mule deer tags than residents do. They’re still recovering from Covid. What a disgrace. Might as well have the inmates running the jail. It’s pathetic actually. Try to get an answer from government on any game management plans

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

Sure, and since we agree that the major variables are feed and winter, how much difference do you think reduced bag limits will make? Once again, WT specific.

My family has only ever taken what we need, which is significantly less than we can get tags for. I remember just once killing a buck that was not a trophy, and was somewhat surplus to my needs. I felt bad about that one, but that winter was harsh and the winterkill was bad... in the end I doubt it mattered one bit whether I killed an extra deer or not.

IMO suplimental tag numbers should be decided by taking into account the amount of snowfall during the past 3 or so seasons. Also wouldnt be bad to factor the amount of usable roads in a WMU into that equasion. I personally was not sorry to see the 2nd tag cut but I felt that doing it this particular season, at least in my area, made very little sense.

Yes and no. I simply see reducing the doe tags from two down to one especially after being told for several years they need to cut back as insurance that we have enough does left after hunting season that if there is a bad winter that kills say 50% of the remaining post hunting season doe population that still leaves enough does to fawn in the spring to at least sustain a rebuildable population as opposed to a collapsed population that may take a decade to recover.

I think the populations of our game animals needs to be monitored much closer than they currently are and tag numbers need to be adjusted accordingly every year in a more real time response.

Game department always seem to be years too late in responding to whats happening with the population be it the need to cut back on tags or to issue more tags in response to a population that exceeds carrying capacity limits. They can't seem to make a decision until its too late. They seem to be the last to know whats going on then stand there with their mouth open catching flies instead of doing something.

[1dayillgetaram]

Originally Posted by binocular

There are 32 zones where outfitters have more antlered mule deer tags than residents do. They’re still recovering from Covid. What a disgrace. Might as well have the inmates running the jail. It’s pathetic actually. Try to get an answer from government on any game management plans

That’s a lie
https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/4550...ed-october.pdf

[W921]

305 used to be general tag for mule deer buck.
They put it on a draw . I can't remember how long it takes to get drawn but outfitters seemed to increase. Then with wolves its just decimated compared to 25 years ago.
I would be curious to know how many land owner permits and outfitter tags in 305 compared to 30 years ago. I just know on the private land that I'm personally familiar with so maybe just my part got hit hard after they switched to draws. I know right now there really is no game at all compared to before and what deer are left seem to be in people's yards for protection

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by 1dayillgetaram

That’s a lie
https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/4550...ed-october.pdf

You are correct. There are actually 33 zones where outfitter tags outnumber the resident tags for antlered mule deer. There are another 5 zones where the numbers are equal. Some of the worst one are mind boggling - WMU 328 - 5 resident vs. 37 outfitter, WMU 318 - 8 resident vs. 44 outfitter, WMU 429 - 5 resident vs. 36 outfitter.