Bow river trout population in serious decline

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by straight

Fishermen...shoot them all! If you float, you see hundreds and they catch lots! They release, but lots of fish dies nevertheless.

Lol

Is this sentence meant to say shoot fishermen?

[North40Rules]

Simple and Best Option:

Set up a lottery system, strictly limit the number of fishermen/women that have the opportunity and access to fish the Bow River.

Do that for a couple of years then reassess the situation. This is nothing new and has been working that way in many places for many years.

[flyrodfisher]

Originally Posted by North40Rules

Simple and Best Option:

Set up a lottery system, strictly limit the number of fishermen/women that have the opportunity and access to fish the Bow River.

Do that for a couple of years then reassess the situation. This is nothing new and has been working that way in many places for many years.

You are proposing a solution, yet you have not determined the cause of the problem.
Are you sure that fishing is the overwhelming contributor to the decline?

Logic would dictate that one determine the cause first...the first step in that direction would be a complete closure such as is currently in effect in the Pembina watershed

Let's see if AE has the nads to try that on the Bow....

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by flyrodfisher

You are proposing a solution, yet you have not determined the cause of the problem.
Are you sure that fishing is the overwhelming contributor to the decline?

Logic would dictate that one determine the cause first...the first step in that direction would be a complete closure such as is currently in effect in the Pembina watershed

Let's see if AE has the nads to try that on the Bow....

The best part about the majority of fishermen, it’s never us, there has to be another cause or reason.

All eastern slopes fishing should be on draw or lottery.

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by flyrodfisher

You are proposing a solution, yet you have not determined the cause of the problem.
Are you sure that fishing is the overwhelming contributor to the decline?

Logic would dictate that one determine the cause first...the first step in that direction would be a complete closure such as is currently in effect in the Pembina watershed

Let's see if AE has the nads to try that on the Bow....

Not sure of anything, except Alberta has very limited fishing resources compared to where I grew up and where I fished one of the rivers the Matapedia River, as an example for Atlantic Salmon, adopted a lottery system and divided the river into many sectors (see attached chart) and a very complete count was taken of all the salmon caught, and how many fishermen were fishing it during the season to get a detailed idea of what was going on in the decline of Atlantic Salmon. The Fishing pressure was also greatly reduced.



A "holistic approach" would be a good step in discovering the issues that are affecting the trout, limiting fishing is only one aspect. One thing for sure it sounds like if nothing is done, the fishery may get worse over time.

These days I fish the Skeena River and what I have seen happen there to the salmon fishery since I started fishing that system is UNACCEPTABLE!

Originally Posted by bartman

Pelicans...shoot them all! 35 years ago hardly saw one while floating. In the past couple of decades, if you float, you see hundreds and they eat lots! They don't release.

I live on a small lake in Edmonton, this summer I have seen as many as 15 Pelicans hitting the lake at once. Every time their head goes down and they lift it up in the air and swallow they are eating fish. Man did the fish ever get POUNDED!!!

A picture I took with my cell phone

[goggin]

If stocking is said to depress resident fish, how does a river like the green in Utah support a reported 15000 fish per mile

[FishingForLife]

So I read this article that was published last fall.

https://issuu.com/albertaconservatio...ive/s/13737707

Good article. I still have so many questions though. I need to find a biologist.
Obviously, the decline has been happening for quite some time, but the article says one of the Big 5 issues affecting the Rainbow population is "Nutrients". Just recently, they sealed up the Water Treatment outflow at the Calf Robe Bridge. Now from the books I've read, they mention that the outflow was one of the main reasons we had the nutrient-rich waters that we did. Sure it was nasty water, but it definitely dumped enough **** in the water to make the plants, bugs, and eventually fish happy. The moment they sealed that drainage up, I have been concerned about how it will change our river. Just one angler's opinion.

[Don Andersen]

Originally Posted by FishingForLife

So I read this article that was published last fall.

https://issuu.com/albertaconservatio...ive/s/13737707

Good article. I still have so many questions though. I need to find a biologist.
Obviously, the decline has been happening for quite some time, but the article says one of the Big 5 issues affecting the Rainbow population is "Nutrients". Just recently, they sealed up the Water Treatment outflow at the Calf Robe Bridge. Now from the books I've read, they mention that the outflow was one of the main reasons we had the nutrient-rich waters that we did. Sure it was nasty water, but it definitely dumped enough **** in the water to make the plants, bugs, and eventually fish happy. The moment they sealed that drainage up, I have been concerned about how it will change our river. Just one angler's opinion.

After watching the decline in the Crow after each of the sewage outflows were directed to the plant in Frank, the Bow is gonna get ‘et.

[goldscud]

New pipes were run out along the stream bed downstream of the bridge across the whole river. The plan is to disperse the sewage outflow across the streambed rather than just down the west shore.

The people in Calgary didn't stop popping. There will be a sewage outfall.
The quality of the outfall has been improving with better techniques in the sewage plant.

For sure, the concentration of Phosphorus and Nitrogen dumped via sewage has decreased with better technology since the 1970's.
One has to wonder about the increase in population in the Bow corridor from Banff to Policeman's Flats. Seems like a few toilets have been added over the last 40 years

[buckman]

Originally Posted by bartman

Pelicans...shoot them all! 35 years ago hardly saw one while floating. In the past couples of decades, if you float, you see hundreds and they eat lots! They don't release.

You shoot one I will cook it, if you eat it!! However joking aside have any studies been done on what these birds actually eat? Is it mostly trout, or suckers and carp.

[goldscud]

I think it would be unwise to assume pelicans don't eat any trout that they can get a hold of and in their throat. Some bigger fish just escape.

I watched a pelican eat a grebe that had a minnow in it's mouth. Pelicans are voracious

[slough shark]

I’m thinking that the pressures on the river are on many different fronts, I’ve seen pike in numbers in areas I never saw years ago, I’ve also seen more birds that prey on them recently as well, these outside factors remove a lot of fish from the river. The sewage plant changes impacted the nutrient level in the river as well. I’m curious the impact of whirling disease, is that much of a factor? I haven’t seen any large die offs but at a younger age we really wouldn’t notice. Fishing pressure has increased too has an impact as well, I’m not sure the best way to deal with that but I’m sure there are rule changes coming, whether they try the gradual option to see if that can help or go straight to quite restrictive. At the minimum I’m guessing trebles are on their way out along with barbed hooks, hopefully they don’t charge extra to fish the river or limit the number of people fishing at once as that will disproportionately affect local fishermen.

[lannie]

Originally Posted by goldscud

I think it would be unwise to assume pelicans don't eat any trout that they can get a hold of and in their throat. Some bigger fish just escape.

I watched a pelican eat a grebe that had a minnow in it's mouth. Pelicans are voracious

Dont know why someone would have a boat prop in the Bow but the injuries look consistent with a prop or a jet boat in shallow water that ran over the trout.

[goldscud]

No motor boats have ever been near those fish. It was pelicans

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by goldscud

No motor boats have ever been near those fish. It was pelicans

Hahaha! Thanks for the laugh!

[goldscud]

Not sure where the humor is, but smile if you like

[flyrodfisher]

Originally Posted by goldscud

Not sure where the humor is, but smile if you like

The humor I see here is that some people think that browns like that only live in the Bow...lol

Nice fish goldscud...

[Jayhad]

No one wants to talk about the wholesale destruction of the riparian environment along the Bow's shore line.

The concrete canalization should not be over looked and it is never mentioned, we are ruining foothills streams in the name of property value protection, when no sane person should buy property in a flood plane.

It is disingenuous that bios don't bring this to the attention of the public.

It is my belief that flood mitigation is solely responsible for the Bow's waning trout populations.

[goldscud]

You have a point about rip rap Jayhad, an engineer response with no input from a biologist. Unfortunately, property/money always seems to win over the fish abundance.
There are lots of factors to consider for a decrease in fish numbers.
The City is actually getting the U of C to look at the effects of sediment load on trout in some experiments right now.

[Canadamanada]

Now do they have any other plans to bring the population back - other than removing fishermen from the river?

[Lornce]

Originally Posted by Canadamanada

Now do they have any other plans to bring the population back - other than removing fishermen from the river?

If they remove the fishermen then no one will report on population declines, water quality, or other water problems. In the government's eyes easy way to solve the problem. No one to advocate.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by Lornce

If they remove the fishermen then no one will report on population declines, water quality, or other water problems. In the government's eyes easy way to solve the problem. No one to advocate.

Kinda like the Pembina. This coming summer will be the 7th year of a five year closure that began in 2016.

[goldscud]

As flows from the mountains decrease and average water temps increase there will no doubt be more stress added to the fishery. One major concern downstream of Calgary is the huge volume of water that is siphoned off at the WID weir near the zoo. Irrigation starts taking water in June. The decrease in natural flows continuing down the river has a large effect on water temperatures and thus oxygen content come July, August and Sept. Will there come a time when the allocation of water to irrigation needs to be readdressed, or does the government just say screw the environment in the river valley?
The history of the government of Alberta protecting environmental concerns over the desires of industry is far from stellar

[Penner]

Single hook barbless and fly fishing only for the trout portion of the river and 100% C&R. Hardware chuckers with treble hooks are very hard on trout.

Shut-down angling when temps reach dangerous range. Have metric that triggers shut-down and metric that triggers when it would re-opens.

Some stocking to supplement wouldn’t hurt if they would stock with fish from the Bow itself to keep strains as “native” as possible.

Some enforcement. I’ve fished that river off and on for 20 years. I’d guess likely ~500 outings. I’ve never ran into a CO once.

[Anomaly85]

Originally Posted by Penner

Single hook barbless and fly fishing only for the trout portion of the river and 100% C&R. Hardware chuckers with treble hooks are very hard on trout.

I'm in favor of banning trebles and barbed hooks, but lets be real...Fly fisherman probably outnumber spincasters 10 - 1 on the bow.

[Bjay]

Try going with a single barbless hook and no bait. Don't wory about the strike indicators. If you can't catch a fish using only one hook then you need more time on the water and that's what every one wants isn't it. More time on the water.
Columbia old guy