Long Range Hunting

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by gopher

And the rifles I use for long range hunting are set up much different than the ones I use for jumping deer out of sloughs.

Any SXS rifles or over and under rifles at the DV shoot? Much less Fixed 6 or 4 power scopes on bolt action rifles with wide duplex or T posts? Of the 40 shooters my money would have been on any one with open sights or a red dot or the above mentioned setups.

There are a couple of fixed 6 powers the years I have participated and those shooters did quite well.

The thing with the rifle rodeo in DV is that at least half your score is comprised of shots under 100yards....all from field positions.

LC

[expmler]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

Don't say none....I have seen youtube videos of people bragging a shot is too close, and then intentionally "back it up" a bit to shoot further....it's a mentality that is alive and well.

I have also seen many videos where people "could have" gotten closer and chose not to.

I can make long distance shots too....but I choose not to practice on a living target, if you can that's cool.

BUT as long as you are ok with accepting the consequence of a wound or not being able to recover an animal because you misplaced the spot where it was standing from 1200 yards away.... BUT for you to insinuate the ones who don't attempt the shots are not capable is a little bit condescending don't you think?

It is not a matter of CAN or CAN'T but more a should or shouldn't....anyone can take a long shot, ending up with the desired result is the key....even a blind squirrel gets a nut from time to time.

Set a limit stay within it.

LC

So you are lumping ALL hunters who take long shots in with a few clowns doing you-tube videos?

I am not insinuating anything, the posters state that they are not capable of making the long shots so they don't try them. That is fine, but then they go on to say that NOBODY should take long shots based on their own inability to make them.

Nowhere have I said that if you choose not to take a long shot even if you are capable that you are less of a hunter than me, it is you who have claimed I am less of a hunter for choosing to take a long shot.

You say you are capable of making long shots, but than you say that making a long shot is mostly luck. So are you capable or lucky?

Setting limits for yourself is great, I just ask that you don't set limits for me.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by expmler

So you are lumping ALL hunters who take long shots in with a few clowns doing you-tube videos?

I am not insinuating anything, the posters state that they are not capable of making the long shots so they don't try them. That is fine, but then they go on to say that NOBODY should take long shots based on their own inability to make them.

Nowhere have I said that if you choose not to take a long shot even if you are capable that you are less of a hunter than me, it is you who have claimed I am less of a hunter for choosing to take a long shot.

You say you are capable of making long shots, but than you say that making a long shot is mostly luck. So are you capable or lucky?

Setting limits for yourself is great, I just ask that you don't set limits for me.

You are putting words in my mouth...I never said nobody should take them.

You said, "those who can do...those who can't post". My reply was a snarky retort to a snarky comment....notice my smilie faces

Can you further explain what you meant because perhaps I misunderstood you?

LC

[Rman]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

You are putting words in my mouth...I never said nobody should take them.

You said, "those who can do...those who can't post". My reply was a snarky retort to a snarky comment....notice my smilie faces

Can you further explain what you meant because perhaps I misunderstood you?

LC

Lots of cardboard honour on this this thread...
"I can, but I won't"
I hunt, regardless of the distance I shoot an animal at.

R.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Rman

Lots of cardboard honour on this this thread...
"I can, but I won't"
I hunt, regardless of the distance I shoot an animal at.

R.

Call it what you want....surely you see my point

Here is a 700 yard target (for scale that's a 2 inch circle)....so what? I still wouldn't shoot a deer from that distance....is this cardboard honor?



LC

[Rman]

Yes, it is.

R.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Rman

Yes, it is.

R.

Isn't that all it takes to hunt at long range?

....or is that not what you meant?

LC

[Rman]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

Isn't that all it takes to hunt at long range?

LC

If that is what you think, then you are even more obviously misinformed than most. I would suggest educating yourself a little bit more on long distance shooting, so you are able to have a more intelligent discussion about the subject matter at hand.

And no, that isn't what I meant...

R.

[58thecat]

Shooting and hunting are two different things all together. A miss or a drift on paper at 700 yards is your buddy picking on you, the sane shot on a game animal is a wounded animal. A hunter should pride himself/herself on getting as close as possible, stalking, hunting and making a clean kill.

Seen it too many times at gun ranges, rested, shots opening up on paper as the distances got farther out to the point if it was an animal it would be wounded.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Rman

If that is what you think, then you are even more obviously misinformed than most. I would suggest educating yourself a little bit more on long distance shooting, so you are able to have a more intelligent discussion about the subject matter at hand.

And no, that isn't what I meant...

R.

Thanks for the clarification and your ever present productive contributions.

The fact that is not what you meant means we agree on more than you are willing to admit.

Long distance shooting? I thought this was about long distance hunting?

LC

[Rman]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

Thanks for the clarification and your ever present productive contributions.

The fact that is not what you meant means we agree on more than you are willing to admit.

LC

Clarification was obviously required, you're welcome. The same can be said for yourself...again, even more so...

No, it doesn't. Not even close. It proves my point.

R.

[David Henry]

A few years back maybe 10 or 12 when those "Best of the West" DVD's were circulating, about tricking out your factory 7mm mag for long range hunting. If your mindset considers this hunting!.
I had quite a few brainwashed followers of the cult come through the shop that had various services performed to increase the accuracy potential of their chosen rifle to give them the upper hand while afield. A very small number of these guys put in the time required to really get to know what their equipment was capable of and they had my respect and admiration for they truly were riflemen or perhaps rifle loonies.
The others can only be categorized as abysmal sportsmen and **** poor judges of distance. Hats of to you guys that put in the time to practice, practice, practice. Regards David.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by David Henry

A few years back maybe 10 or 12 when those "Best of the West" DVD's were circulating, about tricking out your factory 7mm mag for long range hunting. If your mindset considers this hunting!.
I had quite a few brainwashed followers of the cult come through the shop that had various services performed to increase the accuracy potential of their chosen rifle to give them the upper hand while afield. A very small number of these guys put in the time required to really get to know what their equipment was capable of and they had my respect and admiration for they truly were riflemen or perhaps rifle loonies.
The others can only be categorized as abysmal sportsmen and **** poor judges of distance. Hats of to you guys that put in the time to practice, practice, practice. Regards David.

Agreed.

LC

[Okotokian]

I guess I get a little confused when "long range hunting" comes up or someone says they want to "get into long range hunting". I absolutely get it when a hunter gets as close as he can to an animal and it's still, because of a canyon or whatever, 600 yards away. If you can reliably make that shot, go to it. I understand and have no problem with it. I just don't have the skill.

But do some people go out with the express intent to make only a "long range shot" at an animal? Would they not attempt to get closer to the anmal even if they could do so easily? Would they pass up an animal that appears at 200 yards? That, to me, seems nuts.

[expmler]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

You are putting words in my mouth...I never said nobody should take them.

You said, "those who can do...those who can't post". My reply was a snarky retort to a snarky comment....notice my smilie faces

Can you further explain what you meant because perhaps I misunderstood you?

LC

I see these threads come up over and over, It doesn't take long until the guys that take long range shots are called inferior hunters, unethical, blind squirrels.

Your snarkyness was not lost on me, but when I saw the posts agreeing with you I simply wanted to say that supporting long range shooting does not preclude one from having the same hunting skill as shorter range hunters.

By the looks of your target, if a trophy Elk was standing at 700 yards and you could not get any closer you are more than capable making a good shot on him.

If you chose not to take the shot, I would not call you an inferior hunter. If I chose to the take that shot, assuming the same skill level and circumstances many would still say I was an inferior hunter.

I think we can both agree that we shouldn't be taking a long shot just because we can.

But choosing whether or not to take a long shot when that is all you have, should not be the test of ones hunting skill.

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by expmler

I see these threads come up over and over, It doesn't take long until the guys that take long range shots are called inferior hunters, unethical, blind squirrels.

Your snarkyness was not lost on me, but when I saw the posts agreeing with you I simply wanted to say that supporting long range shooting does not preclude one from having the same hunting skill as shorter range hunters.

By the looks of your target, if a trophy Elk was standing at 700 yards and you could not get any closer you are more than capable making a good shot on him.

If you chose not to take the shot, I would not call you an inferior hunter. If I chose to the take that shot, assuming the same skill level and circumstances many would still say I was an inferior hunter.

I think we can both agree that we shouldn't be taking a long shot just because we can.

But choosing whether or not to take a long shot when that is all you have, should not be the test of ones hunting skill.

If you factor one more thing into the equation I bet there would be minimal chances taken for marginal shot opportunity no matter your skill level.

The factor I mention would be economics, if you paid 8 - 10 K for the opportunity to harvest your species many would think long and hard about stretching their limitations. Draw blood, cut tag regardless of recovery.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by expmler

By the looks of your target, if a trophy Elk was standing at 700 yards and you could not get any closer you are more than capable making a good shot on him.

If you chose not to take the shot, I would not call you an inferior hunter. If I chose to the take that shot, assuming the same skill level and circumstances many would still say I was an inferior hunter.

I think we can both agree that we shouldn't be taking a long shot just because we can.

But choosing whether or not to take a long shot when that is all you have, should not be the test of ones hunting skill.

I agree with you on several points, but also at some point folks have to pull off the target and say , "yup it's too far", even if they still have some clicks of adjustment left in the scope....my point is to many having the equipment = having the skill.

Many have the attitude (not saying you or other accomplished long range shooters) ...."if there is lead in the air there is hope".....I know I have heard this phrase several times and I imagine you may have also heard that.

LC

[AJC]

This is JMHO, but to me, hunting has little to do with killing an animal & more to do with the experience. While most of us want an animal, & often that is referred to as a successful hunt. I think getting out, getting close, and enjoying the friendship with the others is far more important. If you can't get close to make a sure hit let it walk. Hell, then you don't need to clean it & pack it . I have missed sure shots at game much closer than 500. To be honest most of you have as well. Just the game deserves better.

[Quinn]

Originally Posted by AJC

This is JMHO, but to me, hunting has little to do with killing an animal & more to do with the experience. While most of us want an animal, & often that is referred to as a successful hunt. I think getting out, getting close, and enjoying the friendship with the others is far more important. If you can't get close to make a sure hit let it walk. Hell, then you don't need to clean it & pack it . I have missed sure shots at game much closer than 500. To be honest most of you have as well. Just the game deserves better.

Good post.

I'm a new hunter and with quite a bit of long range shooting experience and I agree. I

I'm thinking of heading out this fall just for the enjoyment. I probably wont take the shot
even it presents itself. I'll let others have the fun and lend a helping hand.

[Steadyhigh]

Originally Posted by AJC

This is JMHO, but to me, hunting has little to do with killing an animal & more to do with the experience. While most of us want an animal, & often that is referred to as a successful hunt. I think getting out, getting close, and enjoying the friendship with the others is far more important. If you can't get close to make a sure hit let it walk. Hell, then you don't need to clean it & pack it . I have missed sure shots at game much closer than 500. To be honest most of you have as well. Just the game deserves better.

Hunting has everything to so with killing an animal JMHO

[leo]

Originally Posted by Steadyhigh

Hunting has everything to so with killing an animal JMHO

I disagree. And so I don't cause a derail, I'll ask the question in a new thread.

[Cappy]

I have burnt out 3 .308 barrels 1 .338 barrel and I am on my second .260....and the last 3 are in the last 5 years. I don't even bother counting 5.56 anymore. I would not hesitate if the proper conditions presented themselves to take a reasonably long shot on an animal with the proper equipment. That being said I also bowhunt, harvested my antelope after a total of 3 hours of belly crawling into a final shooting position a couple weeks back.

Does the fact that I would be very comfortable taking a 600 yard shot on a relaxed animal make me less of a hunter? I practice more then most and am confident in my abilities. However all that practice has also taught me my limitations and the limitations of my equipment. What I often find is an ignorance is bliss type attitude. People will not truly take the time to learn the variables involved and will fail to understand that because you centre punched a 700 yard shot today down by Medicine Hat does not mean you can do the same thing 3 weeks later with a 20 degree temp change up at altitude in the Willmore.

I don't generally see then need for shooting at animals past 800 yards. They don't shoot back and it usually isn't very hard to close into a more shootable distance. That being said, if and when I ever get a Suffield bull tag I will be practicing a lot before the hunt and if the conditions are right and its the last day of my, most likely once in a lifetime hunt. I will not feel less of a hunter taking the shot at long range, because I know I will be doing so with the confidence of getting a solid hit. If those conditions aren't right I wont take the shot, its that simple.

To the gentleman who posted the effective ranges of various calibres. The general rule for "effective" is based on the military standard of an 80 percent chance of getting a a hit and looking at the distances for the .308 and .338 those are the standards. From first hand experience getting a first round hit at 800M with a .308 takes practice and lots of it, especially when your variables change and the wind picks up at all. You start going past 800M and factor in terrain you better be a heck of a wind reader because even the mighty .338 Lapua is not impervious to wind. That factor is based on the cartridge and if the shooter does everything right.

It ultimately always comes to the nut behind the wheel. The best equipment in the world will not make you a 1000M shooter if you aren't driving the gun properly.

[catnthehat]

I've killed some animals at distances long enough to be called a Bs'er by some, unethical by others, and a down right slob hunter by others.
I've also been congratiulated by some hunters, but in the end some guy stands up and still says " it's shooting not hunting".
Well if stalking and watching these animals for the whole danged summer, patterning them for months before hand to figure out where they will be , and setting up so the shot can be made is not hunting , I don't know what is.
I no longer attempt kills at long range because i don't have the time to put in to practice with my rifles at long range.
My shots are considerably closer these days because I enjoy hunting with iron limit my shots depending on the rifle i am using .
Cat

[purgatory.sv]

Sorry for the derail.

Long range is in my comfort zone.
Never get out of the blind.

If you as an individual are comfortable just do it, then share your results.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by tchardy1972

There I very little difference here compared to taking a 100 yard shot at running game. I would bet that fewer animals are actually wounded at long range.

And that's why I don't shoot at running animals at 100 yds. either. I been to the Rifle rodeo shooting at the running deer, 95% of the shooters can't put a kill shot in it. And 95% of those hitting it with a kill shot the first time wouldn't be able to do it a second or third time. Sure the running deer was hit by several people but getting shot in the legs, or places that would be grazes or gut shots, the antlers, tail, nose/jaw are not proper kill shots.

It comes down to whether you know you can hit it where you want or your just hoping that somehow your bullet is going to kill it. Most who shoot at animals that are not stationary are only shooting at it on a hope and a prayer that their bullet might miraculously somehow hit it.

[duceman]

95%! lol! pretty generous allowance; i'd wager less than 1% could reliably make that shot. i've shot a £~£|€*~load of coyotes on the run; i doubt 2 have been what i would call a proper kill shot.
but i am practicing my 550m shooting; and if my wt buck does what i think he will (because i've been watching him for 2 weeks now, and will continue to till opening day), that is exactly the shot i expect to take.
if by some miracle the wind isn't howling, and he stands where i hope, i'm actually excited to take the shot. i will have as much chance with that scenario as any other on opening day here in the bald - ass prairie, lee

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

And that's why I don't shoot at running animals at 100 yds. either. I been to the Rifle rodeo shooting at the running deer, 95% of the shooters can't put a kill shot in it. And 95% of those hitting it with a kill shot the first time wouldn't be able to do it a second or third time. Sure the running deer was hit by several people but getting shot in the legs, or places that would be grazes or gut shots, the antlers, tail, nose/jaw are not proper kill shots.

It comes down to whether you know you can hit it where you want or your just hoping that somehow your bullet is going to kill it. Most who shoot at animals that are not stationary are only shooting at it on a hope and a prayer that their bullet might miraculously somehow hit it.

Hey, I hit the running deer- well sort of, I think I hit the wire that was holding it up??!!
Cat

[260 Rem]

Several times each year, I overhear a shooter mention how surprised they are that the Big Bore at SPFGA goes out to 400 ... It is actually 300. I also suspect some of the 700 yd kill shots I hear about might have been closer to 400. Without good equipment, most of us are terrible judges of distance. Practice, equipment, and experience adds up to competence.