Go Back   Alberta Outdoors Forum > Main Category > Trapping Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-30-2024, 11:10 AM
Rob Miskosky's Avatar
Rob Miskosky Rob Miskosky is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,062
Default Furbearer Limits (Quotas) have been removed for 2024-2025

For the 2024-2025 trapping season, all furbearer limits (quotas) for wolverine, river otter, Canada lynx and fisher have been removed where there is an open season. Please see the updated trapping regulations and limits at https://albertaregulations.ca/trappi...ns.html#quotas
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-30-2024, 10:19 PM
treeroot treeroot is online now
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 426
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Miskosky View Post
For the 2024-2025 trapping season, all furbearer limits (quotas) for wolverine, river otter, Canada lynx and fisher have been removed where there is an open season. Please see the updated trapping regulations and limits at https://albertaregulations.ca/trappi...ns.html#quotas
Would be cool if they allowed residential trappers the odd year to get a couple animals they normally can not target.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-30-2024, 10:29 PM
aarjay aarjay is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 17
Default Quotas

Great news. Thanks to all who worked on making this happen. Quotas were never a management tool anyways.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-31-2024, 08:51 PM
Outlaw2277 Outlaw2277 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2024
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by treeroot View Post
Would be cool if they allowed residential trappers the odd year to get a couple animals they normally can not target.

Buy a trapline, make the investment like the rest of us and you will get quota.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-01-2024, 08:36 AM
treeroot treeroot is online now
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 426
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Outlaw2277 View Post
Buy a trapline, make the investment like the rest of us and you will get quota.
Not my point...

Limits and what you can target needs to be able to change over time. As pop go up and down, rules need to change with it.

There was no otter in my WMU, or very little, on both RFMA's and private.. now the population has exploded.. F and W has confirmed this with me. So why not let residential trappers take one?

What's the reasoning behind allowing RFMA's to have no limits this season?

I'm sure the same reasoning for allowing RFMA's to have no limit this year can also be applied to residential trapping.

If the reasoning is to allow trappers to make a bit more money this season, can this not be applied to residential guys?

You don't think residential trappers have to invest? It's not nearly the same as a RFMA (which I have also done in the past), but its still an investment. Not many ppl are trapping anywhere right now because of fur prices, including residential trappers.

Seems like some people are only in favor of helping out trappers if it only benefits them? Or maybe some people think RFMA holders think they are better than residential trappers?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-02-2024, 11:45 AM
3blade's Avatar
3blade 3blade is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 5,343
Default

The reason is to hold onto the current system

If registered lines go unused, the provincial government faces pressure to turn it over to the more-equals. As it stands the provincial government can prove conclusively that registered trappers are a useful wildlife management tool. Removing quotas helps increase harvest. If there is little to no harvest or data, that argument fails.

The courts (heavily influenced by federal politics) will give the more-equals everything they want and more. So you don’t go to court against them without overwhelming evidence

Resident trappers are viewed as recreational (or problem wildlife control), and will never be a higher priority than more equals or registered. No it is not fair, or right, but the wildlife management world rarely is.

If the more-equals get their way there will be no (non-treaty) trapping, and most low information urban voters would be happy to see it that way. Stop fighting amongst yourselves.
__________________
“Nothing is more persistent than a liberal with a dumb idea” - Ebrand
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-02-2024, 01:07 PM
treeroot treeroot is online now
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 426
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3blade View Post
The reason is to hold onto the current system

If registered lines go unused, the provincial government faces pressure to turn it over to the more-equals. As it stands the provincial government can prove conclusively that registered trappers are a useful wildlife management tool. Removing quotas helps increase harvest. If there is little to no harvest or data, that argument fails.

The courts (heavily influenced by federal politics) will give the more-equals everything they want and more. So you don’t go to court against them without overwhelming evidence

Resident trappers are viewed as recreational (or problem wildlife control), and will never be a higher priority than more equals or registered. No it is not fair, or right, but the wildlife management world rarely is.

If the more-equals get their way there will be no (non-treaty) trapping, and most low information urban voters would be happy to see it that way. Stop fighting amongst yourselves.
I agree. I never started the fight, but I don't agree with someone's idea of entitlement. Either way, a trapper is a trapper and should back each other up, not divide.

Not doubting you, but where did you learn the reasoning behind the quote removal?

If we actually let the system do exactly what it is supposed to do, unused lines would be taken and given/sold to trappers willing to trap them.

If you don't catch your quota, and have no justifiable reason why you didn't, you should loose your line to the long list of trappers eagerly waiting to have a line of their own. The list of trappers wanting their own line is quite long depending on the area.

Justiable reasons would have to be set in stone reasons such are logging, fire etc.. saying "I was working too much this winter" should only be acceptable with proof and only acceptable for a couple of years.


This just doesn't happen though.

I know dozens of lines that do not get trapped. It's been in the family for years... The older trapper no longer can trap and no other family have any interest but they don't want to let their cabin in the woods go.. If you talk to these families they openly state they don't trap it anymore because they themsevles often don't understand the contract the trapper has with the government to trap it.

99% of the time I ask the senior sign on as jr, I get no.. and the reason given is they believe if they sign on a jr, the jr will take the line from them.

This is the problem... yes fur prices suck, but lets be honest, trapping is just a hobby these days.. a wildlife management tool for the government, but to the line holder, just a hobby..

If the government started seeing lines for a couple years, those family line holders will likely step up and trap.. Which is what should happen.

They have policies, but they don't want to enforce them..

And then we have the issue of lines being sold for hundreds of thousands of dollars.. You should be able to get your money back (including improvements you made on the line), but line prices have gotten out of hand for a long time now.

My point is, untrapped lines are easily fixed if they ever decide to enforce policies..

It would be hard for a family to loose a line that's been in the family for decades, but start trapping it or loose it to someone who will. If I was in their shoes, it would be a crap situation, but that is the contract the trapper has with the province.


I should add, I can not state how many times RFMA holders have asked me if I would sell my furs (trapped on residential land) to them so they can claim them.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-03-2024, 01:07 PM
walking buffalo's Avatar
walking buffalo walking buffalo is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,472
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3blade View Post
The reason is to hold onto the current system

If registered lines go unused, the provincial government faces pressure to turn it over to the more-equals. As it stands the provincial government can prove conclusively that registered trappers are a useful wildlife management tool. Removing quotas helps increase harvest. If there is little to no harvest or data, that argument fails.

The courts (heavily influenced by federal politics) will give the more-equals everything they want and more. So you don’t go to court against them without overwhelming evidence

Resident trappers are viewed as recreational (or problem wildlife control), and will never be a higher priority than more equals or registered. No it is not fair, or right, but the wildlife management world rarely is.

If the more-equals get their way there will be no (non-treaty) trapping, and most low information urban voters would be happy to see it that way. Stop fighting amongst yourselves.

What is the connection between an unlimited bag limit and the discussion here regarding quotas?

They are not the same thing.

Have quotas also been eliminated?




How is an unlimited bag limit going to be argued in court as evidence of effective "wildlife management"?
For some species, such as wolf at peak populations, sure, that could possibly be successfully argued...
As for Otter or lynx or martin....
This would be a difficult legal argument requiring a pile of new science and a potential media fight in the public realm.


Regarding evidence of increased Trapping line value due to a short term increase in harvest based on unlimited harvest having legal power in the courts to prevent transfer to First Nation control, think again.
The more valuable the resource is, the greater the potential a demand to "share" and for the courts to require more "sharing" of the resource.


-----


What is the government's reasoning for this change?
__________________
Alberta Fish and Wildlife Outdoor Recreation Policy -

"to identify very rare, scarce or special forms of fish and wildlife outdoor recreation opportunities and to ensure that access to these opportunities continues to be available to all Albertans."
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:51 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.