Black Powder rifle for noobs,**NOT** modern inline rifles

[icehunter]

This is for new shooters who want to get into black powder percussion shooting , but have no idea what is involved with it or what they need.Lets keep it simple for beginners just as I was and still am but now have a little knowledge in it...Thank You...Ice..* ( If any one wants to add info please feel free to do so,just keep it simple)

OK folks....I got into bp shooting just over 2 years ago. I was never around one but got started in it with a few good friends who had done it for years. So here are the basics to get up and shooting bp rifles..First off you need a rifle.

Now you need your shooting supplies...they look like this..



An now for a individual look at each one with a average price..First off is a possibles bag as they are called. I wanted a leather one but couldnt find it so had to settle for the camo one. They are used for carrying all your bp supplies while out in the field. Average price is $35-$40 for one..



So forward we go..first off we need some powder and balls to shoot. Please check out recommended loads for your rifle and load weights ..and dont exceed them..



An now we need some fire to get the fire going..caps....namely percussion caps. I have been using cci ones,never had a problem with them and by a 100 pack expect to pay $4-$6 for a tin full of 100..



Patches,without them the ball will simply fall into the barrel. They lube the barrel as well as create a tight friction fit for the ball. One thing to note in my pic,the patches on the right hand side are prelubed and when fired CAN START A FIRE IN DRY GRASS...so be wary of that.The bottle beside it contains whats called moose milk. Its made up of a few different things which are covered in a different thread if you want to play with things. Patch material for the milk can come from different sources,but for a beginner lets keep it simple and use prelubed patchs of the proper thickness as prescribed in good loading data.



So now we need to carry some powder...these are called flasks. I personally like the one on the left hand side as its a civil war era repro flask,right is a antique bone powder flask. Alternately if you cant find either you can still use a spoon to fill up your powder measure,its just a pain in the butt to do it that way.Cost are right around the $40 mark for either...but your mileage may vary..



Powder measures...2 shown but both do the same thing.They are graduated from 10 - 120 grains each. You simply unscrew the locking collar,set for your charge weight,lock the collar back in and you are good to go. On the funnels you will notice a thing that slides back and forth. What this does is slides one way and stops,you fill the measure up with powder from your flask then you slide it the opposite way and you have a very simple funnel to pour the powder in your barrel. Just make sure to give it a few extra taps after pouring to make sure all the powder is out of it and you dont get a under or over charge upon firing your new bp rifle..Cost is about $15 bucks or so..



Now the next thing is a short starter. What this does is allows you to start a slug with ease.I will post a couple of pics as to how its used.




So lets assume you have powder in the barrel as mentioned above..now the first part of a short starter allows you to seat a ball with ease...notice that I have a patch on the barrel and a ball ready to be seated.* please note I am doing this in my house and am not loading up a live round*




now the short starter being used..Note that the short starter has 4 tools to it,first it has a swivel stud for ease of carry in the field,its round on top so that using it really saves your hand from punishment while reloading,the longer part is to seat your ball/bullet down to where you can finally seat above said projectile with the long ramrod on your rifle...and finally a drilled out section that will fit over your ramrod and not wreck your hand. More pics..So here we go..

Powder in the barrel,patch on top,ball ready to go in and the shortest part of the short seater ready to start seating..



Now the second part is to use the 6 inch part of the short seater and push the ball down further..



The reason for it being round is that its easier on your hand when seating a ball or slug...now next step...remember from above the drilled out section of a short starter...here it is



This will fit over the ramrod from your rifle and make ball/slug seating easier I prefer the old fashioned method just because...but women like doing it this way cause its easier on the hands for them. For some reason photo bucket is really screwing up right now...so gonna post the rest of this later..K photo bucket is back up and running and so am I. Here is the next pic for ya.So you started with the short starter,then the 6 inch end of the short starter and now the ramrod.It only takes 2 or 3 good pushes to seat the ball on top of the powder.The ram rod can either be done with your hand and no short starter as I prefer or it can be done like this.Place the drilled out cavity ( on the short starter) and use it to push the ball home. One thing to remember,when the ball seats you will know it.Dont try and keep hitting it down cause you arent sure and compress the powder charge down to tightly.Alternately you can *tamp* the ball down.This is done by either using the ram rod in your hand and tamping the ball in place,or using the short starter and placing it on top of the rod and using your open palm and hitting it and forcing the ball down on top of the powder charge.Either way works just fine..



Alrighty so we have powder in the barrel,a ball seated and now for fire. Place a cap on the nipple and you are good to go.Push the cap down tightly,hammer is already cocked,watch your trigger closely cause you are ready to fire...




This is the end result...dont expect a big bang,its more of a click,followed by a split second and a kerWHOMFP....lots of smoke,little recoil,lots of burnt gunpowder smell...and a grin from ear to ear



there ya have it folks...bp shooting on a very simple scale...Oh by the way,if the wind is right,fully expect to go home reeking of burnt black powder..

[Matt L.]

Reeking? How can you reek from black powder?

Great tutorial icehunter, something I definitely want to get into.

[petew]

well done.
I might add that real Black powder will be more reliable for ignition than the substitutes like pyrodex.. Flinters in particular are just not going to like the subs. Marketing tells us real BP is hard to clean, but in reality it cleans easier, and is more reliable than Pyrodex ,777 etc. but it is harder to find.Stock up when you can.

It's nice to see a thread like this where muzzle loading is kept in the spirit and tradition of what it is. Simple close range shooting with basic gear. Unfortunately marketing has all but wiped out traditional Muzzle loading.

[catnthehat]

The shot nipples tend to help the ignition of Pyrodex, but the best is to use real black powder, as Petew said
It would be nice if we could sticky all these tutorials - I'll contact Alberta bigbore and see.
Cat

[petew]

Perhaps we need a Mythbusters type thread dispelling the evils and downfalls of real ML shooting with black powder and lead balls. They are very reliable and simple , if we do our part.
Pete

[Dave the Demon]

its not so much the BP the reeks ive found but that pyrodex is foul when burnt. get doused in the smoke from that and no one would wanna be near you

[Snakeneil]

Very nice, wish this would have been posted last spring. I picked up a repro Kentucky long rifle at a gun auction but had never even seen one fired before. I asked around but ended up just finding some info online and faking it, what a blast! A word to the wise though, don't inhale till the smoke clears ;-) I love my percussion BP but got to try a flintlock brown Bess out at the range last week & now I want one of those too ( not to mention flintlock pistols)!

[Hagalaz]

Great tutorial.

Is that a Deerstalker or a Trade Rifle that you are using?

I picked up a .50 calibre Deerstalker flintlock in December & man am I loving it. Much more fun than firing modern rifles.

I am using Goex 3F for the main charge, I tried Pyrodex but it didn't seem to work for me as well as the real black powder does.

[petew]

Hagalaz:
You are right about the powder observations. 3f is so much more reliable. Also 4F in the pan helps a lot too. Get real flints and the sparks are much better than with those factory cut ones. If you get some welding torch, tip cleaners they are perfect for picking the vent hole to make sure it is clear.
When you do a dry ball in a flinter, and you will, LOL the easy way out is pull the touch hole liner and work some priming powder in the chamber, then fire the ball out. If it doesn't go out, ram it back down so you don't have a blocked barrel and repeat. It is easier than pulling a stuck ball. It doesn't take much powder to do it.
on a Percussion cap you can pull the nipple and do the same thing.

[icehunter]

Originally Posted by Hagalaz

Great tutorial.

Is that a Deerstalker or a Trade Rifle that you are using?

I picked up a .50 calibre Deerstalker flintlock in December & man am I loving it. Much more fun than firing modern rifles.

I am using Goex 3F for the main charge, I tried Pyrodex but it didn't seem to work for me as well as the real black powder does.

That is a TC Renegade in .54 cal.That is my friends rifle and the one that got me hooked on shooting BP. I looked for over a year to find a TC Hawken in .54 cal. Here it is



As well I have a Hawken in .50 cal. The 50 hasnt been fired since 1987 when the owner passed away.That was till I got ahold of it,just 3 months ago.It has converted a buddy of mine to black powder traditional shooting as well as a 12 year old friend fired it and had a big grin after.All I fired last year was BP. I didnt put a round out of any of my modern rifles,not even a .22

Thanks to who ever stickied this,next up will be a tutorial on how to clean a black powder rifle and show just how easy it is. Here is a pic of my first ever shot out of my .54 hawken. The ler scope came off right after and the sights were put back on and its just way more fun that way.We filled up every can,jug, non glass bottle with water and what a peacefull way to shoot targets at 5 am on a Sunday morning..

[2 Tollers]

Nice and thanks

Now if there is someone that uses a flintlock and is willing to put up the same I am interested in taking a step further back in time.

[petew]

A flinter is realy the same, just a diferent source of sparks. I love the Flinters.
The Flintlock got a bad name and it shouldn't have. Most problems are caused from a poor choice the shooter was talked into. Cut Agate flints are junk, and not known for reliable good sparks. Use knaped flints and that is 1 problem less to deal with.
The next source of problems on a flinter is powder. Flint locks hate Pyrodex. 777 and all the other new powders. They do like Real BLACK POWDER, and are very reliable with it.
3F will work in the pan quite well, but 4F works better and is quicker to flash.
Don't over fill the pan, a small caharge in the pan fires faster.
Keep the vent hole cleared , and make it a habit of picking it after each shot. A welding tip cleaner on a lace tied to the trigger guard is a good tool to have at hand.
Having the flint positioned corectly in the jaws makes for a good spark. Pad it with leather to keep the flints lasting longer. I get up to 70 shots from a flint before needing to sharpen it. Set the flint to barely clear the frizzen at half cock.

I will add some more after supper.

[petew]

If you do not get good spark first make sure you have real flint in the jaws. Set the flint to barely clear the frizzen at half cock. Make sure it is the right size, and square to the frizzzen. The frizzen must be clean and dry!!!NO OIL.
Still poor or no spark, remove the lock , cock and fire it in your hand . without powder!!
If it sparks now, you have something hanging up in the trigger or lock. Often screws have been overtightened creating binding. Take a look for interferences in the lock to wood, springs and the trigger sear.
If when you tested the lock for spark outside the gun it is not sparking and you have a good flint, set properly, turn the flint over, and try again. Some like bevel up some bevel down.
look for something binding. Does the frizzzen flip over easy or hard? Does the frizzen fit squarely on the pan? Often it is just a matter of smoothing the frizzen to spring contact to make it smooth and reliable.
If the hammer falls quickly, and the flint makes good contact and still no spark you may have a bad frizzen, a $20 fix and 10 minutes of your life. Do not oil the frizzen. It stays dry or no sparks will be made.
One thing to remember, Flinters will shower the person beside you with a jet of very hot gas when the charge goes off.
Pick the vent between shots, Run a damp patch down the bore before you reload, use good flints and real BP and you will see just how reliable a flinter can be.
Let the inline guys use sabots, and pistol bullets. Round balls or maxi's of pure lead do just fine in our guns.

Pan Primer for Flinters.

[ishootbambi]

Originally Posted by icehunter

So forward we go..first off we need some powder and balls to shoot. Please check out recommended loads for your rifle and load weights ..and dont exceed them..






Powder measures...2 shown but both do the same thing.They are graduated from 10 - 120 grains each. You simply unscrew the locking collar,set for your charge weight,lock the collar back in and you are good to go.
.

clear and concise with one very important error that you described twice. guys who know already know, but since this is aimed at noobs, it is VERY important to understand that BP and its substitutes are measured VOLUMETRICALLY, and NOT by weight. the powder measure meters a volume of powder. the term grains may confuse some, but please do not weigh a charge on a scale thinking it will work out fine. a volume measure must be used. carry on.....

[icehunter]

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

clear and concise with one very important error that you described twice. guys who know already know, but since this is aimed at noobs, it is VERY important to understand that BP and its substitutes are measured VOLUMETRICALLY, and NOT by weight. the powder measure meters a volume of powder. the term grains may confuse some, but please do not weigh a charge on a scale thinking it will work out fine. a volume measure must be used. carry on.....

Thank you for pointing out my error,so lets clear that point up. Yes black powder and substitutes are measured by volume.So I scooted outside on a nice warm day here and took a pic. Notice that the measure is locked in at 100 grains. This is 100 grains of B/P by volume as it being a cylinder shaped object and NOT 100 grains on a scale. Good point you made and thank you for catching my error..

[Shannon89]

My brother in law shoots black powder and loves it. one day i may look into it, but theres a lot to know and a lot involved so when i think I know then I will have to look into it.

[coyoteman]

Used a 54 cal hawken for years--target-and hunting.For hunting pre loads were made,and carried in containers for that purpose.For big game 120grs ffg wasused,With R E A L bullets[rifleing engaged at time of loading]With iron sites,I didnt shoot at game much over 100m,and found the large bullet very effective.I shot two caribou over 100m,they dropped immediate.On the range gong ringing was fun-for safety purposes I used a stainless steel rod with bore protector.The gun over all excellant, and surpriseingly accurate.The hot water and soap cleaning method worked fine,and was used after every outing.